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What do you believe in?

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monserrat's picture
User offline. Last seen 10 years 8 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2004-11-11

Dear Libervisioners,

James and Prosario are very religious and believe in God. And I guess most of us do as well. I don't and I'm not a religious person.

But there is one thing I've learned in my life: no one can live without believing in something. I couldn't live at all any moment of that if I didn't believe in something which makes sense for my life, gives me meanings for the world I live.

Well, I believe in love, solidarity, comprehension, tolerance, the positive values of humanity. I believe in the possibility we are able to construct colectively a better society from the current one. My believes in this regards are very close to the cristian ones, though I don't believe in God.

A close friend of mine said to me once that my humanitarian values and believes were what he called God. I got surprised, but eventually I think I understood him. We called the same thing with different names. Maybe. Wink

So, what do you believe in?

Rijik.

User offline. Last seen 15 years 1 week ago. Offline
Joined: 2004-12-07
Re: What do you believe in?

I believe in God as described in the Bible, which I believe to be the inspired, infallible and inerrant word of God. That core serves as the basis for everything else.

Beyond that my beliefs are in line with the Baptist Faith and Message of 2000: http://www.sbc.net/bfm/default.asp

My particular doctrinal views are in some areas more narrow than the BFM but it serves as a good general summary for what I believe.

---

I wasn't always a Christain or a Baptist (Southern Specifically). Until 17, 5 years ago, I was agnostic with atheistic tendencies so my beliefs on matters of faith are not an entirely natural or conditioned part of my thinking. But as you may have guessed I am rather fervent regarding what I now believe and know to be true.

memenode's picture
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Re: What do you believe in?

I am coming from an Adventist family and adventist religion is as i hear very similar to baptism with some basic differences being that adventists keep saturday as the seventh and holdy day, not sunday, as written in bible. That is why we're also called "Seventh Day Adventists" (SDA). The center of all adventist doctrines is bible.

As for my beliefs i mostly tend to believe in God, his existence and everything in bible as i many times found it more than "conviencing". I sometimes look at the events happening around us in the world and see how well it fits to the predictions from bible for this time and future. This is what "forces" me to believe. My biggest problem however is in that it seems a bit hard to myself to keep what i believe, to live by it. I don't go to church very much and i am not a very good prayer nor i have an urge to explore bible further. This makes me farer from religious person than my beliefs might be.

However, i try to do good things, things that are not contradicting the ethics of bible and hope to gain some more strenght and enthusism about rest of my religious beliefs to finally start living it in practice. I guess that, what i lack is a "personal experience" with God which many believers had in one way or another. A moment in life where they were so sure and aware as well as blissed by His presence, that it changed their lives.

Thank you
Daniel

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User offline. Last seen 11 years 31 weeks ago. Offline
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Re: What do you believe in?

Well, explaining my religion is a bit difficult, because one of its central points is that any attempt to describe [the undescribable] is blasphemy. Although [the undescribable] (probably) is the same thing other people call "God" or "the gods", I don't use these words as they are a description (for example it implies that [the undescribable] is some kind of being or a set of beings).
Why is this blasphemy? Simple: [the undescribable] is perfect, and words are always imperfect.
[The undescribable] is the cause of all beauty, and beauty is something that occurs on the border between order and chaos.

This does indeed mean I consider all "holy" books blasphemy.

Before I "saw the light" (not literally), I was first an atheist, then an agnostic.

User offline. Last seen 15 years 1 week ago. Offline
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Re: What do you believe in?

PK, that is interesting, does your religious belief follow any formal teachings or other organized doctrines or precepts? Is there more available that describes the scope and specifics of your faith?

memenode's picture
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Re: What do you believe in?

I think many people today actually don't need any more doctrines and descriptions to justify their faith and views. Their logics and knowledge are enough. I'd say most of such people tend to be more atheist and scientifically minded.

I am not speaking for PK in this, just pointing it out. Let PK answer your question James. :-)

Thanks
Daniel

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User offline. Last seen 11 years 31 weeks ago. Offline
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Re: What do you believe in?

Hi James,

My faith is based on two things:
- observation of the cause of intolerance between religions: all holy books are attempts to describe the same thing, but there are differences that make some people believe they are different. Also, they are misinterpreted, often on purpose.
My conclusion is that it is not possible to accurately describe [the undescribable]. If I would try to describe my religious experiences (to be some kind of "prophet"), I would cause more intolerance, which would be doing evil.
- my own experiences. I am not special, anyone who opens their mind and their heart will find [the undescribable]. Many will find a holy book that is similiar to their perception of [the undescribable] and convert themselves to its teachings. This is not a very bad thing, as long as they do not become intolerant to other religions. It's even possible that reading a holy book will lead you in the right direction, but it also could blind you from the truth.

[The undescribable] is everywhere, also in the holy books, but just as much in, say, a teacup, or the look of the stars. However, a holy book is much more dangerous than a teacup, because it is an inaccurate description of [the undescribable].

If you look further than merely seeing, if you do not just experience but experience the experiencing, you will find the beauty that is in everything, and know its cause. If knowing would imply being able to describe, this world would be much better. Sadly, knowing can be perfect but words can not.

I do not know anyone with the same or similiar beliefs to mine, partially because I do not want to explain some important things. Obviously, my beliefs do not come from a book or what someone else told me. Then they would contradict themselves....

For a long time I have been thinking about writing down the part of my beliefs that can be written down. I just did it now. Sorry, I cannot tell you more. Noone should start looking for [the undescribable] regarding what I wrote as "facts". It would be too ironical if I got followers. I just encourage everyone to think about religions and beliefs, and if they come to different (or the same) conclusions, I would like to know.

User offline. Last seen 11 years 31 weeks ago. Offline
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Re: What do you believe in?

...and, of course, I believe a better world can be created trough cooperation.

User offline. Last seen 11 years 31 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2004-08-23
Re: What do you believe in?

Although it is not directly linked to my beliefs, this is related, and an interesting read too:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_Of_God

"[the undescribable]" could be a translation of "Hadavar", but it's not.

monserrat's picture
User offline. Last seen 10 years 8 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 2004-11-11
Re: What do you believe in?

Wonderful, You-are-PK !

I love your "[the undescribable]" !!! :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes:

It reminded me the sheep the Little Prince wanted a guy drew for him. Do you know that estory? The Little Prince was never satisfied and found faut with the drawing for every and each new attempt of the guy.

In the end the guy found out a way to satisfy the naughty boy: he drew a box and said to the Little Prince that the sheep was inside. Finally the boy got happy!

The 'sheep box' is the [the undescribable]!!! You're free to imagine whatever you want to for the [the undescribable].

Rijik.

User offline. Last seen 15 years 4 days ago. Offline
Joined: 2004-12-11
Re: What do you believe in?

I would define myself as a Secular Humanist (though I have to confess, I don't care for the term)

From a Secular Humanism Website

Secular Humanism is a term which has come into use in the last thirty years to describe a world view with the following elements and principles:

* A conviction that dogmas, ideologies and traditions, whether religious, political or social, must be weighed and tested by each individual and not simply accepted on faith.
* Commitment to the use of critical reason, factual evidence, and scientific methods of inquiry, rather than faith and mysticism, in seeking solutions to human problems and answers to important human questions.
* A primary concern with fulfillment, growth, and creativity for both the individual and humankind in general.
* A constant search for objective truth, with the understanding that new knowledge and experience constantly alter our imperfect perception of it.
* A concern for this life and a commitment to making it meaningful through better understanding of ourselves, our history, our intellectual and artistic achievements, and the outlooks of those who differ from us.
* A search for viable individual, social and political principles of ethical conduct, judging them on their ability to enhance human well-being and individual responsibility.
* A conviction that with reason, an open marketplace of ideas, good will, and tolerance, progress can be made in building a better world for ourselves and our children.

I am not involved in any organizations or groups that advocate Secular Humanism. I do however share their worldview and agree with the elements and principles they advocate.

I think there is a lot there that most free software supporters would agree with.

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